Re: Urban Dictionary for Metis (non related debate)

[White Stripes]

ifdef win32? .. hmm.. wheres the cross platform version?

now lets see the other four "__TESTING"

[Bluey_412]

Finally Bluey. Bluey Bluey Bluey... I have said sorry to the people i need to, just because your weren't one of that (seemingly) select group, don't get all bum-hurt over it.  Most developers will know that at the beginning it takes time to pick up new languages and the way I was compiling the program was a little naive with test commands in maybe. If you want to pick through the unpacked server commands, you'll notice there was a new colour code in the server for many versions before it was fully released (changing colours as you describe it) and there is even changed RSWCS tags code in there too that noone has picked up on yet either.  There are test features to display packets received in the chat window and all sorts of other information that noone has spotted or complained about, all of which are legitimate stuff the same as the commands.  Difference is noone can pretend those features arent genuine test features and really "backdoor takeover commands or features" as some of you guys have implied.  Yet with all those test features in the programs its still tiny due to the use of the compress which can easily be decompressed as all it does is condense the code to make the file smaller it hides nothing.  Therefore the reason people trust me, is because I TRY.  Something the community has yet to see from you.  Your quick to complain but can you check over the RSWCS executable and then say sorry to me "big man"?

You dont have to apologize to me, i never used or looked at any of your stuff...

I was/am simply an observer, and offered you some sage advice....

Obviously the smartness of youth is still stronger than the wisdom of Mature...

[GhostShip]

Don't see wmw handing out copies of the cache software, patch sourcecodes or hidden "core" protocol discussions!

Its a pity your so unprepared when you come to trade words with me Ritchy, if your going to make claims at least be able to back them up, unlike yourself I believe in learning from hard learned lessons and thus unlike yourself I share such srcs with folks who can be trusted and who are either in a position to learn from them or ready to put them to good use should anything happen to the site or the staff, yes some of those folks who have the srcs are staff members but many are not, both pie groups have the sources to both the patch and the caches as well as many private developers who are not staff here but "core" developement members.  Its never been a secret that we have a developement area on this site unlike the hidden sections on the your forum and its always been open to those who ask and are seen to be genuine folks either as programmers of seekers of advanced information regarding the network, my goal when heading up this site was to ensure the community was not just supported but empowered and sharing out our "gold" was always thought to be the simplest way to ensure continuity of the community if the worst came to the worst, this has been applied to the design of the community cache system and it relies on no single point of failure, sharing things is what we do best, be it trust, friendship, knowledge or pesky src codes that some ppl make a big deal about but are in reality only useful for certain applications and thus on their own are pretty useless to most folks, I wont suggest they are useless to someone looking at new ways of attacking users and I,m sure you of all ppl will appreciate that.

End Note : Just because one does not see something it does not mean it does not happen, btw I havent checked out any of your plugins so if anyone has time to do so please post the results so we can all rest easy in our beds ....or not.

[RebelMX]

Since the plugins are opensource it should be easy for you to check over being the development expert now with your own project.   The sourcecodes are very similar to read like wcb plugins or metis scripts.  Next you'll be claiming they have backdoors too I guess...

The cross platform section Stripes is by using the ifdef WIN32! LOL i.e. the stuff in that ifdef is only compiled on windows versions and on unix that is omitted making the source cross platform.  I am also looking for testers on the new linux version I have created if you want to get more detail?
Stripes the other 5 (not 4 my bad) __TESTING's currently in the servers are:
1)

            #ifdef __TESTING
               Console(line);
            #endif

2)

                  #ifdef __TESTING
                     Console(line);
                  #endif

3)

                  #ifdef __TESTING
                     Console(line);
                  #endif

4)

                     #ifdef __TESTING
                        Console(line);
                     #endif

5)

               #ifdef __TESTING
                  Console(line);
               #endif

Hope this is useful...


Its not about smartness Bluey its about knowledge on a particular subject.  You have none on this field yet you comment generally.  Therefore "the smartness of youth IS still stronger than the lack of knowledge of the mature".

Finally Quicks, you ask for sourcecodes to be released generally then only allow "trusted users" to have copies of the "community" programs.  Hardly a community program when there is a single person or small select group whose personal feelings may or may not affect what they define as "trusted".  I am not asking to be included in this but you cant expect a general sourcecode release when you yourself are holding all your cards close to your chest.

[Bluey_412]

You dont know what I know, or Dont Know, so dont presume, young grasshopper...

[Pri]

This is all getting a bit silly, Richy has his story and he's sticking to it we can either accept it as genuine or not. I'm not really sure so I'm just going to air on the side of caution. I won't be using RSWCS myself (not that I was going to anyway to be honest) but I'll continue to make my current and future scripts compatible with it and I won't publicly discourage its use, of course I won't be promoting it either.

[GhostShip]

Your focusing your words at the wrong person Ritchy I don't want to see your src codes the same as I didnt want to see them when KM wrote the majority of it, if I leave this network no one will say Quicks left us without the tools we need, its a pity you don't have a single person you can trust who could act in the same capacity or better still be able to vouch for your work.

Lets not beat around the bush here Ritchy your not trusted and your ethics stink, I have seen you myself going from room to room scaremongering and abusing your talents to get folks on your applications, no other programmer has done anything like that nor will they because they know the difference between right and wrong, you don't seem to know the difference and thus cant be trusted , all the time I spend here on this topic is wasted time but guess what to protect the WinMX community I will spend that time each and every time you post until you get the message that an apology is needed before any line in the sand can be drawn, You could have apologised and been a part of the core a long time ago as you do have some talent that would benefit from some of the info we have on offer but because a cloud is hanging over your character I cant gamble on giving information or help to you that could be used to abuse the general community and not just the chat folks, its that simple.

Many of the other community programmers are way ahead of yourself in terms of raw talent and yet strangely they wouldn't dream of abusing users or looking solely for exploits instead of creating great new software, I understand that you too want to have an impact but from my point of view and in the opinion of many others you are unable to put the needs of the community first, instead because you crave attention you look at ways and method to force folks to rely on you blindly ( by scaring folks off their current unmolested server solutions) and its that power crazed activity I have an issue with, its plain and simple bullying, now put yourself in my position would you want folks to use software that comes from such a character or worse answers to no one ?

Do you think about how much of other peoples time you are wasting while you are under a cloud trust wise, folks shouldn't have to check through your work looking for exploits they should have confidence in both you and the software you release and be able to make a choice based not on fear but free will. As I made clear I had hoped you had grown up some and lost your bad character traits but that hasn't seemed to be the case, if you cant tell the difference between right and wrong there is no place to build any trust and the apology I asked you for was to be simply a signal that you had recognised your own short-comings and wanted to put those behind you and move on, it seems I hoped for too much from you.

[RebelMX]

Your subjective view of right and wrong doesn't mean the entire community are behind you.  Yes they all want the best for the network, but your leadership (call it what you like) does not mean people will accept your words as is.  Unfortunately Pri has summed up the answer to this issue.  I have attempted to offer you the history, background and clear examples of my trustworthiness, if you can't accept that then so be it.  I answer to, not you surprising enough, but to the actual users and hosts using my program.  Clearly that doesn't include anyone at WMW as they are more than happy to pick the faults but won't actually test, trial or even look over to clear up the "bad feelings" hanging over the RSWCS project.  That's fine by me, up until now I've carried on without assistance from Core.  This time round at least folks in the community can actually read this thread and hear the whole story, including actual code examples of test/debug features and a full explicit description of each of the "backdoor commands".
Hopefully this ends this thread please will an admin lock this to allow users to view the discussions without the pointless posts of some people (i.e. Bluey) which have no relevance to the thread (I'm all for you giving your opinion but you've openly stated you've never used or tried testing RSWCS so why comment further?).

[Bluey_412]

Using or Testing RSWCS is not the be-all or end-all of my existence
my interests in WinMX and the net encomapass bigger things than a suspect chat server.
My posts were not pointless, but simply, alas, your ego prevents you seeing and understanding what they really are, or contain...

Too bad...

Your reputation will continue to suffer

[GhostShip]

Clearly that doesn't include anyone at WMW as they are more than happy to pick the faults but won't actually test, trial or even look over to clear up the "bad feelings" hanging over the RSWCS project

Any "bad feeling" are down to your own lack of action in apologising Ritchy, perhaps one day you will grow up but until then I,ll be watching your releases for potential problems in between other things I,m busy with.

I cant say I,m surprised with anything you have said in most of your recent posts as they simply reinforce what I have said about you not perceiving the difference between right and wrong, I wish you well Ritchy I really do but I simply cant see a way to have trust with a guy who cant accept he let the community down and is too scared to say sorry in case he loses face, when your all grown up you,ll laugh about your actions but for now I cant afford to make merry over any potential backdoors and other threats that you continue to pose.

Have you ever wondered why your release was checked for backdoors Ritchy ?, it surprises me you never asked this simple question, maybe you already know the answer.

[Bluey_412]

Funny how the Young and Foolish always tend to sneer at the Older and Wiser, until they become one themselves...

Then they say 'Oh how stupid I was...'

[White Stripes]

Have you ever wondered why your release was checked for backdoors Ritchy ?, it surprises me you never asked this simple question....

o.O;

i wouldnt mind knowing this one myself...

Then they say 'Oh how stupid I was...'

for the lucky -- the school of hard knocks only has to hit once...

[wonderer]

My four cents in this discussion, my view as a chathost on the trustworthyness of WCS or any clone of it.
It would need a trustworthy coder to make me believe in any program coded by KM to be cleaned of all hidden commands, backdoors, home calling or whatever more that is not needed to run an genuine chatserver.
Another option would be to make the source available to some one you trust and is trusted by other users to have the source declared free from the above mentioned culprit.

It is hard to get to be trusted as a clean coder,
It is very hard to regain that trust after making some "mistakes" discussed in this thread, most of all for the reason not being removed in a release version.

[RebelMX]

Thanks for your straight forward and sensible comments wonderer, its about time someone said something relevant.  I totally agree with everything you have said.  Problem being I would doubt WMW and Quicks would accept any winmx user aside from their own staff.

I feel I have been open and would show the sourcecode to a "colleague" who I trust, but anyone I trust would probably be counted as colluding with me in trying to cover up my hostile intentions or some such rubbish...

Have you ever wondered why your release was checked for backdoors Ritchy ?, it surprises me you never asked this simple question....

Quicks, I've never asked as I have assumed the answer.  Maybe not the one that you think it is but nevertheless I don't care.  I would hope you took as much interest in every program developed for the community if not then I'll take it as a compliment that you want to check my programs.  As I have stated there have been all sorts of stuff tested and added to the program and you have picked up on only 1 set (the commands) so either your not sure what to check for (well spotted on the commands since I and no other user had spotted they were included until then) or the rest of my workmanship is above board and therefore there is no big hoohar needed about it.  You posed the question why not answer it as many including Stripes clearly want to know?
You just keep on watching me, I love knowing I have an admirer!  Maybe one day you'll finish your own "project"...even a screenshot would encourage the community that progress is being made

Finally, Bluey, just being older does not make you wiser.
Here's some proverbs for you this time..."A fool at 40 is a fool forever" or "There’s no fool like an old fool"
and last but no means least "Any fool can criticize, condemn, and complain, and most fools do."  Benjamin Franklin

[White Stripes]

...but nevertheless I don't care...

at least you are honest about that...

[Bluey_412]

so why dont you just come right out and say 'I know everything, so kiss my A$$ and let me make my own mistakes'?

[Edit]

Added: Of course, you DO know everything....

Except what I do and dont know, and that, my friend, will remain that way

For you, all hope is lost

E-Serv rules!!

[Bluey_412]

I would hope you took as much interest in every program developed for the community if not then I'll take it as a compliment that you want to check my programs.

Somehow, i dont think that the Checking is meant to be taken as a compliment, you are a known rogue

Once a Rogue, always a Rogue

Your arrogance is simply astounding

[Bluey_412]

Ever thought of going into Politics, they love rogues and liars...

[tig]

Problem being I would doubt WMW and Quicks would accept any winmx user aside from their own staff.

Rebelmx what are you on about?

Are you just presuming this statement or are you trying to say something?

[Bluey_412]

Have you ever wondered why your release was checked for backdoors Ritchy ?, it surprises me you never asked this simple question....

Quicks, I've never asked as I have assumed the answer.

What's the first three letters in the word 'Assume'? Right... 'Ass', thats what you are likely to make of yourself if you assume too much, like you did this time