Another Patch In The Works ?

[bughunter]

im not so sure you have thought this thru nobby,all thats going to maybe happin is an alternative patch which may or may not be open sourced is going to be released at some point in the future........
the current km/ merlin edited patch isnt going to be made redundant,why should it be after all km has no control over it and cant stop anyone from useing it, all he can do is stop certain websites from promoteing it...i for one would be very dissapointed if the intention was to deliberately break winmx in order to force users to use the new patch.....  all the new patch will do is give pie users little excuse not to use a proper connection / blocking solution,as you term it, it will be kmware free, but thats if the community vote for it to be open sourced.... as ghost has stated it will be released based on a community vote, and if the status quo remains it will most likely be closed sourced as the previous test poll indicated.....after all ghost cant ignore a vote and release said patch as open if the community votes closed as this would raise serious creditabilty issues....
and it makes no difference if a independant devolper releases a open sourced solution, doesnt mean anyone is going to use it does it, it will just be another patch.and if any of these patches dont use the winmxworld blocklist, which is the only accurate blocklist avalable as indicated by the current situation with bluetacs lists and the issues raised on slyics forum then it would be as useless as tits on a bull.......
im not trying to get at you, as like you i would prefer to see it open sourced, all im trying to say is if things dont go the way you would like are you really prepared to go back to the bad old days of bitching, finger pointing and abuse......or is it better to accept that even thou the patch is closed at least it would be kmware free and thus acceptable to pie users and we can all move forward and try to make winmx a better place to be...........

[+KM+]

The open/closed source debate it not relevant to the idea of people selling patches, for example, you can "buy" winmx from some sites now, and thats a closed source program right? There were even people trying to sell KM's closed source patch on ebay as i recall.

Indeed, it's all down to licensing, for example any license that restricts someones right to sell it would not be open source would it? in actual fact it would be more restrictive than a simple closed source public domain work. Also funny how you don't see the stupidity of your own argument there - you point out how someone tried to sell a closed source patch and had it removed for breaking copyright law, as some sort of claim of how you can sell it??? my closed source patch for example anyone selling it would be liable to prosecution, whereas if someone were to sell for example robomx that would not only be legal, but if bender attempted to stop them then they could sue him for damages...

As for your concerns, i agree, its right to show concern, but you must also take into acount the simple facts of the matter, most of the proposed patch code is already in the public domain if you look around for it, and anyone with real intent and ability to mess with the network will do so, whether there is an open source patch or not.

having seen the attempt the winmxworld admins are working on - i bet they wish your claim was true, in actual fact none of the major bits for a filtering patch are public domain, the only thing that is would be encryption, the actual work of patching and filtering is not (although there are various hijacking methods with public domain source available, the code to make that in to a filtering patch is certainly not available).

The flip side ofc is, that open source will provide benifits that closed never can.

yes, it would benefit you a great deal if your scam sites could legally sell it without anyone being able to stop you...

I would have preferred Ghosts team to have released an all encompassing open source patch, it would keep things simple, however if their work is hindered and constantly abused, then an open source patch from a independant would be hugely welcome.

can you repeat again how people posting on this forum somehow makes the slightest bit of difference to if any of the winmxworld admins have the knowledge to make a patch or not? i clearly missed the explanation that justifies the repeated claims i've seen on here where you and your pal ghost try to blame everyone else for your own lack of ability...

in actual fact having seen what they are trying to do, the person supposedly making this patch has shown through the code he has copy/pasted together that he has even less understanding of what he is doing than bender did when he made bendmx... that bendmx that sometimes works in some rooms when your winmx is set up a certain way and the wind is blowing the right way

It's not hard to make if you know what you're doing, however nobody from winmxworld has a fucking clue what they are doing... and the few with any form of ability whatsoever get treated by the winmxworld admins in the typical mxpie way of "no we know better we are the experts so shut up and go away"

Of course we shall see what happens if someone does eventually go and release information on the network to those who know enough to abuse it just not enough to figure it out in the first place... (there are quite a few of those people around, as you well know)

after all ghost cant ignore a vote and release said patch as open if the community votes closed as this would raise serious creditabilty issues....

you seem to forget, he has none of that - who would believe a word he said when you consider most of what he says lately is a lie?

and if any of these patches dont use the winmxworld blocklist, which is the only accurate blocklist avalable as indicated by the current situation with bluetacs lists and the issues raised on slyics forum then it would be as useless as tits on a bull.......

I should hope if someone did decide to take up with a patch etc they would chose to use their own block list and not winmxworld's, as ghostship has already announced that the winmxworld block list is no longer a list of flooders but in fact is a list of anyone he doesn't like - so i should certainly hope that an alternate block list of just flooders were used to avoid giving him the ability to censor even more... (I am so opposed to censorship such as that practiced by winmxworld that if required I would of course assist with the required tools to maintain a block list, tools which are now after additional development superior to those given to winmxworld that they use for their block list)

[bughunter]

quote from km...
after all ghost cant ignore a vote and release said patch as open if the community votes closed as this would raise serious creditabilty issues....
you seem to forget, he has none of that - who would believe a word he said when you consider most of what he says lately is a lie?

well km is was made abundantly clear to me that i was neither wanted nor welcomed on this forum or the winmxworld helproom, i guess the only reason im not banned is they know its all to easy to by pass any ban, as for anyones creditabilty includeing ghosts thats up to each indivdual to decide, all i was saying was to ignore a vote would raise issues you clearly have little confidance in anything ghost has to say, as for me ive given up careing.......
since there is currently little alternative to winmxworlds blocklist, and since as you say you have devolped better tools perhaps you would like to provide a blocklist of your own..........

[-KM-]

As you know I have no desire to run the network (or essential network operations) any more, hence my closing down winmxgroup...

My current fully automated block list has a detection time of around 10 minutes from a new flooder coming online (tested with simulated flooders, i've yet to see a real one using it myself), and does not depend on someone being awake, which i'm sure you'll agree is better than the over 12 hours with nobody around that the winmxworld block list had recently (although of course me_here lied claiming it was less than an hour, and also lied again in that same post claiming she can get updates out in a couple of minutes)

So of course I am quite capable of assisting someone else in setting up a block list of flooders with very little work to maintain it (or of course I could just give them the same things I gave me_here that is used to slowly maintain the unreliable winmxworld list, but i doubt anyone would want that), however I shall not be maintaining or hosting that list for them myself (I may in the future make the list public for use by my software however I will not be making it public for the purpose of using it to maintain the network).

[Me Here]

Can we please have a discussion here that does NOT include insults and name calling?  Im sure the registration here says 13+ to register and so can we start acting like we are all adults now.

I dont know what takes over with some of you, we all have strong feelings about a lot of the subjects that a new patch bring to mind and I cant see where calling names and insulting each other is helping anything.

So again I'll ask you to keep it civil or dont post. I could get all mean and gnarly, show my teeth at a few of you myself but thats not getting us anywhere.  So Nobby I'll ask you to refrain from posting if you feel the need to insult, your far to angry at that given moment to post and should go breath for a moment first.

Km I see no reason for you to keep coming screaming how the sky is falling and your the only person that knows this and the only person that can fix it and the only person that is worthy of the throne and yet you can sit back for months allowing your programs to damage the network just to prove a point, and create a self fulfilling prophecy. 
All ive heard from you since you quit and dumped thousands of users in the waste bin not giving a rats ass about any of them because you were upset and angry with us or rather me, is
I'm the only one that can operate the network, it will be gone in a week.
I'm the only one that can operate WinMX World site and keep it going, it wont last a week.
I'm the only one that can make a peer cache.
I'm the only one that can make a patch.
Everything I dont touch is shit.  Ask any one trying to develop anything in the last two years that have come to you for help, ive watched you tell them they are shit what they are doing is shit.. over and over..
No one can build a chat server no one can build a client no one can do anything but me! and i quit.
I'm the only one that can exploit it no matter if you close source it or not.
I'm the only one that can blah blah blah blah....
Me me me me me me me me me me what about me look at me listen to me

Thats all i hear from you.  And I wish there was some more polite way to say this, but really I cant think of any.
You dropped the site you dropped the users and now you care about them soooo much that you must keep coming here and build your huge fan club up and show the world that they are doomed.  What is the point in that if its not to take it down.

You left here and took your toys with you, yet you want to come and show everyone that your the only big man that can make anything work.  So we are doing the best we can to ensure the network keeps operating and when thats done Im off.  Ive had enough of the power trips and the crap.  Trusting ppl like yourself only to be stabbed by it later repeatedly.  But unlike your selfish ways we dont want to let the network die or leave it in a state of chaos.  All we want is for it to continue after we are not here after you are not here and anyone reading this is not here.  Its a thorn in the RIAA side, its a great community worth saving and your just trying to destroy it or you'd be doing something about all these problems that you created.

Ice your not banned from the room or site, and i did ask you to contact me to discuss this on msn or someplace and you havent yet, I wish you would.

Now can we please not have a repeat of the other threads pertaining to patches and keep this civil after all its not like we dont all have the same goals and wishes for MX (excluding KM, honestly have no idea what his wishes are I can only speculate by his actions) to keep it going with or without ourselves for a future and keep sticking it to the RIAA for trying to monopolize an industry to thier own means.

[..Ñøßߥ..]

.
im not trying to get at you, as like you i would prefer to see it open sourced, all im trying to say is if things dont go the way you would like are you really prepared to go back to the bad old days of bitching, finger pointing and abuse......or is it better to accept that even thou the patch is closed at least it would be kmware free and thus acceptable to pie users and we can all move forward and try to make winmx a better place to be...........

I have thought the issue through, i am ofc speculating on the possible outcomes of the current senario, i am ofc unlike many trying to add a postive slant on things, rather than the doom and gloom from km and crew. Yes, i agree, a KMfree patch would be good, BUT, closed source would not be supported by many, this would result in less support and unification than open source.

I would also say Bug, with KMs recent track record, would you not consider it as important for WmW to ask users to switch to something else, as it would be to ask users to remove WCS in favour of Ouka or FX?

With regard to other non WmW parties that are developing patches, with all due respect, i think you missed my point. Your correct, whos to say their patches would be used? My point being though,  once 1 person releases the open source patch, the cat so to speak is out of the bag, most of the Anti open source crowd here dont want it released as they fear what it will be used for, but is someone else already released it, then that rather mutes that arguement, does it not?

As for you km:

"yes, it would benefit you a great deal if your scam sites could legally sell it without anyone being able to stop you..."

I do not own any scam sites, i do not intend to create any scam sites, i have never sold winmx, or any related patch or software, as usuall, you are full of hot air and simply doing your best to cause arguements, whilst in the background you prepare your lastes KMware creation, and from what i hear, looking for someone to front a site for you, why? cause you have lost all credability within the community yourself.  This amuses me really, the self proclaimed King of winmx, self appointed over lord of the network, now realises the communuity WILL survive without him, and he is left reduced to flooding with his silly little toys, and flaming at his former strong hold. lol

[bughunter]

quote from nobby .......

I would also say Bug, with KMs recent track record, would you not consider it as important for WmW to ask users to switch to something else, as it would be to ask users to remove WCS in favour of Ouka or FX?

i would hope it was a given the update bar would be used to great effect in adviseing users of the avalabilty of a new patch not to mention the main page of this site would be used to explain why it was important to update.........
and of course as you are aware this forum advised room hosts to switch from wcs to alternative hosting solutions, given the garbage data that was flooding the network from wcs, even if km was correct and this data was minor the point was it was unneccessary and only added to the general network degradation this network already  faces from the cartel...........

[GhostShip]

Is this "superior technology" KM the same guy who took 6 weeks to fix a typo ?

I dont see how KM was able to state he has seen the Patch being worked on unless one of the two people with it have handed it to him, he may in fact be talking about a much older version Hollow was working on.
Even though I did explain to him myself that there is more than one version doing the rounds, he seems to have arrived at his claims of "everyones is clueless" based on old work from months ago, obviously anyone who thows names and tantrums to spite others on the network is hardly worth the communities trust, this is very much why he reurns to rubbish this site as he stated was his plan to me recently.

Those plans are to firstly destroy this site and start his own up, he is however finding it hard to find a front man for the site, atm he is trying to work his way through our old/current admins to ferment trouble and cause disruption, playing on minor incidents behind the scenes to cause many angry posts, this of course is desperation on his part, I personally have had enough of this child and so has the other founder, so perhaps in a way he is winning the battle.

Of course its easy to destroy your friends and cause fighting amongst them but in the cold light of day its clear to all KM has no wish to help the community further as he stated himself, so whilst we keep him amused for now his next attack tool is already in the works, he is calling it a bot, but if it works as he has told me, anyone operating it will be helping to damage the network, he is relying on ignorance of what he can do with a primary bot to put his plan into action, I caution you all not to use such a program, to do so is to give him yourselves to use as a launch platform for his attacks on anyone he does not agree with as he did with WCS, I ask you all to think of winmx and its community before thinking of utlising such a program

I hope all of you understand this site and its operators will not act in the same childish manner as KM or leave you all in a confused mess or worse disconnected from the network for being so trusting, I would like to thank those who have kept faith with us also, thank you all folks.

[bughunter]

km believes everyone is clueless , stupid and braindead...........
but at least these braindead clueless stupid idiots are doing there very best to improve things for everyone, and for that we the community applaude them for there efforts and look forward to seeing  and useing what ever it is that is finally released........
safe in the knowledge that winmx wont suddenly fail just because someone got out on the wrong side of the bed........

[..Ñøßߥ..]

agreed

[chuck]

LOL Now this is the KM i remember from the early days of winmx. Just a little older Josh AKA Snip. Shame we cant just pull a saber on km and add him to a block list call it KMbGone . Funny how people never change isnt it?

 I love how some people still take up for him with all the Bs he saved winmx. The only reason he did any thing is he could not  program his toys to work on another p2p so he had to keep winmx up if not no on would give a shit who he was or where he was.

Sad little man he is.

[Scyre]

I am not so quick to jump on the bash KM bandwagon...

First, I am not forgetting what he HAS done FOR the community, and also that we are all still connected using HIS creation...

It just seems now that as soon as rumors of new patches start circulating that everyone decides KM was a waste. Was he really? Think about all the people he DID help and how much of the last couple years he donated money and a lot of design to make sure we could connect and not get flooded out.

Sure he may not be the only one who could write a patch, but he should still be appreciated for the patch, peercaches, blocking mechanisms, and everything else he put into it.

Just because people aren't getting along doesn't mean he never did those things.

As for a new automated blocking list, I think that is a GREAT accomplishment! I had no idea the process of discovery and inclusion could be automated! Instead of everyone so quickly throwing stones, think about what this means for the community. This is perhaps the best new thing since the patch itself!
Imagine MX with flood control that no one has to be constantly tending to! I would think you guys would feel the same way, especially since that is one thing EVERYONE here seems to agree on is blocking and filtering.

Another thing that seems like just a wild claim is the idea that KM is trying to find someone with a site to host his things... Where did yu get that idea from? If there is validity I would like to know, since he already has a couple of sites of his own, and recently shut one down even. That just didn't make much sense to me. Wouldn't he release things on his own site like he is already doing?

I would also like to ask about this 'bot' that was brought up. What exactly is it, and what do you mean exploiting primary usage? (sorry don't remember exact words it was on previous page somewhere...lol)
But I would like to know if there is really something to be worried about technically. I don't think he is trying to find a launchpad for an attack, as everyone knows he could drop everything right now if he realy wanted to he knows MX so well.
But, if there is some sort of technical issue to be considered, I would like to know so that some sort of solution can be developed quickly. If there is something in the works that is not healthy, then we all need to know about it!

and chuck, 2 things...
I do not agree with the idea that he couldn't make tools to work on another p2p. He is a true developer, and he would figure things out pretty quick I bet.

And the second thing... I like your avatar, it is funny as hell lol

Be Good,
Scyre

[Me Here]

Scyre no one disputes what KM has done, does that give him license to your WinMX soul.. he seems to think it does.  He thinks he owns mine and yours and everyone else's and has all rights to do as much damage to this site, ppls lives as he sees fit and WinMX network as he likes.  (again i can only judge by recent actions). 

As for his blocking I have no interest in it myself and if we did, did you not read this:

(I may in the future make the list public for use by my software however I will not be making it public for the purpose of using it to maintain the network).

Sound to me like more of the same.. childish crap saying how superior he is to everyone else and isnt it tough crap that hes got it and not going to help anyone or the network with it.  More of the same I'm the only one that can ... (insert anything you like here).

Sorry but at this time hes acting like a selfish child and im not about to sit back having the site abused daily now, users abused daily, being personally attacked every time hes bored and not call him on it.  Its real easy to sit back and criticize every one else's efforts and for what gain?  So its like this for me now Scyre and you cant possibly care more about him or know more about what he has sacrificed for winmx users then myself and hes not any different to anyone else in my book atm.

Lead, follow or get the hell out of the way!

And the source of this rumor of him wanting to start his own site and replace this one was himself via phone and msn converstaions hes said it more then once to more then one person.

[GhostShip]

Scyre can I suggest you speak to KM to clear up his plans as they where rather clear in at least the last two communications I have had with him.
Go to the SRC.

Now I dont actually want to burst your bubble on what you mention but it was suggested to KM and agreed by him that there was a simple way of automating the blocklist some time ago, and at this juncture I would like to further point out that whilst we all do credit KM for his fine patch the filtering concept behind it was not originally something he came up with, it was actually the work of "7" the old MxCentral site host who suggested utilising the information contained within the results packet to keep tabs on the flooders, this was followed up by my own work on documenting the protocols in early 2006, and yes there are witnesses to this activity and then some time after that KM delivered on a patch capitalising both Nushis basic mx routines and his own skill and working with info that had been handed to him, so I feel happy to declare that whilst he is a great programmer for what he puts his mind into he is a bit lacking on crediting others for their work or help.

Lets be clear here, we have always been happy with KM,s work right up until he decided that he no longer wished to be involved in anything , since that day he has indulged in all sorts of schemes to disrupt the community and drive users away because "he can", I no longer feel he represents anything good for the network and at each juncture he is proving me correct, it seems a shame many wont raise their voices to tell him attacking the network was wrong, but will come here to complain about trivial matters, hopefully those folks will be the ones saving the network next time we have an emergency, problem is I dont think thats going to be the case.

[Scyre]

Well, maybe he will change his mind about this new automated blocking system in time... We can hope lol
It would be a nice feature for winmx!

And thank you for clearing up the site subject. This is the first I have heard of it, and still am not sure why he would want another site. He could easily use one of the ones he has now, I would think lol.


I was already sure he had based some things off of nushi's work, never knew where the actual blocking idea came from though. But I am glad it was implemented lol

It am glad to see you publically stating that before things went sour you had always been happy with his work, and as you put it 'credit KM for his fine patch'. That shows that you did have appreciation for his efforts, and even acknowledge it now that you guys are not on good terms. It is also good to see you acknowledging the others that contributed to the process. I for one never knew 7 had been involved with the blocking idea, and maybe a lot of people will now be able to be appreciative to everyone invloved.

Some of the history of where we are now has actually been lost in history lol. Many people are not aware of any of it, much less some of the specifics you have mentioned. It is good that people can know some of who to thank in all this.

Be Good,
Scyre

Be Good,
Scyre

[Scyre]

lmao...ok, be good twice!

[MinersLantern]

All I can say is well...
It's about time.
I've been whining and bitching that the entire deal should auto-detect and auto-block according to the behavior of the connections for several years. If my little humanoid eyes can detect 'strangeness' on the connections, and my nimble little fingers can lookup and firewall abusers of the connection, so can windows or linux. Lets see how flooders can purchase ranges and keep up with several thousand blocklists, all of which are different, and constantly change. 

I find now that my distrust in KM is being reduced each day.

I imagine that the auto detecting method would of course mean search blocks would be a bad thing. Since it's easier for the software to detect flooders if it can search for terms like free and a few other things I can't say...
because such 'words' 'may' be possibly 'copyrighted'.

Now I will stop rambling, since I have no idea how the WPN works. 

[..Ñøßߥ..]

I find now that my distrust in KM is being reduced each day.

 :shock:

[MinersLantern]

What?
Programmers are naturally arrogant power hungry and controlling, as is anyone else in any field of technology.
And say what you may about KM, but he is certainly a programmer. 
and yes, I still run WCS. Mainly because it is a very good server, no I don't see any weirdness anymore on its connections, if I do see that happen again, (in a serious way), watch just how fast I can change everything hosting right back to the 'real' winmx.
Yall really need to learn to relax. 
(writing a better cache server would be nice too)

[MinersLantern]

and if KMs new WCS doesn't stop spamming me to update to the latest new version, i'm going to send it to petsex. lol